[rubyruby27]

Hearing date for MSJ/Motion to Preclude/Motion to Compel discovery on 9-19.

When I filed all of these I wrote a letter to the Court saying if my motion for MSJ is denied, to save the courts time I would like to be heard on a Motion to Compel Discovery.

In Florida the opposing side has to fax no later than 5pm 3 days before. The RCP's say 2 days but it must be faxed no later than 5pm the day before the 2 days starts.

If mailed then it must be mailed 5 days before the hearing--now based on the above then I would have to say it must be mailed the day before the 5th day.

Anyone know FL law on this is Engima around or Rikers.

I recieved the plaintiffs objections to the discovey request.

Here is FL law ----A pro se does not have to ask permission to do discovery- black and white in the RCP's.

During pre-trial the court granted the Plaintiff discovery. I have a copy of the Judges paperwork that is in the court file. It doesn't matter as I have every legal right to demand discovery without the permission of the courts.

OK, here is thier response;

1. The FRCP's have not been invoked by the court in this case. Therefore, the defendant is not entitled to engage in the discovery requests referred to herein.

2. Standard to broad, burdensome,immaterial, irrelevant, and not calculated to lead to admissible evidence in this case.

I know what I want to say in COurt, but what do I say that won't get me thrown in jail for contempt.

They mailed this on 9-13 which would be the 6th day before the hearing. I didn't recieve their opposition to my MSJ, which I should have, unless they waited until after 8 pm to mail it. According to my post office, if your mail is at the main post office at 8pm it will go out that night, after that time it may or may not go out until the next day.

I have to re look up the timeframe on when they had to object to discovery, I think that timeframe is 10 or 20 days prior to the court hearing?

What do I say to the Judge about this objection to get sanctions and legal fees

[roybean]

Seems to me like you answered your own question. I don't know about Florida law, but why can't you say what you just said above which is that you have the court's approval for discovery. And look at your statutes to see which rules applies to discovery abuse because that's what it amounts to by not co-operating in discovery requests.

When in doubt call the judge's clerk and ask.

[rubyruby27]

I know I am in the right, I want to say something that will piss the Court off at the Plaintiff and get sanctions without pissing the court off at me.

They are really stupid or think I will go away with their response.

They are suppose to be lawyers that do nothing but credit collections, you would think they know the law or they could read my motion my first 2 paragraphs in the motion to compel is quote FRCP.

[roybean]

You're Pro Se, and I think it is the norm to try to intimidate you. Write what you have or what you think you want to say and post it and we'll critique it.

[rubyruby27]

Thanks Roy,

What I want to say will put me in jail. I will have to think about this and come up with something that will keep me out of jail.

[roybean]

Originally Posted by rubyruby27

Thanks Roy,

What I want to say will put me in jail. I will have to think about this and come up with something that will keep me out of jail.

In the legal world use that anger to finds case law that is similar to your case and pencil whip their behinds. Have a drink or however it is that you chill out, and start digging and writing.
Set it up like this:
Now comes the Plaintiff pursuant to such and such and submits motion in opposition to whatever it is they filed.

I. Procedural History
Insert some case law and past rulings in such instances

II. Statement of Facts
On such and such date the court did this and that.
the Plaintiff filed so and so on this day
The defendant talks out the side of their necks
The court granted (You) so and so and so as per whatever law


III. Statement of Questions Presented
Is the Defendant in violation of so and so statute
Is the Defendant dirty and low down
etc.
etc.

IV. ARGUMENT
Here is where you put that anger by stating laws and statutes and quoting case law under each of your arguement.

V. Conclusion
For the foregoing reasons, the Plaintiff respectfully requests this honorable court to do whatever it is that you want.

[rubyruby27]

Again thank you for your assistance, this will be oral since my case is being heard in 4 days. I think from how I am reading the RCP's if I don't have a copy of their opposition to my MSJ tomorrow, this is all a mute point, since the deadline to mail their oppositon was the 13th.

According to my post office if they mailed it after 8pm then the mail may not go out until the next day but it is postmarked for the correct day. If not here tomorrow then I probably will win by default.

Another question what is your interpretation of this rule

FRCP 1.090 Time states;

When period of time prescribed or allowed is less than 7 days, intermediate sat, sun and legal holidays shall be excluded in computation.

The RCP's states for MSJ the opposition must be mailed at LEAST 5 days prior to the hearing.

Trying to figure out if they are already late and I can win by default.

[roybean]

Originally Posted by rubyruby27

Again thank you for your assistance, this will be oral since my case is being heard in 4 days. I think from how I am reading the RCP's if I don't have a copy of their opposition to my MSJ tomorrow, this is all a mute point, since the deadline to mail their oppositon was the 13th.

According to my post office if they mailed it after 8pm then the mail may not go out until the next day but it is postmarked for the correct day. If not here tomorrow then I probably will win by default.

Another question what is your interpretation of this rule

FRCP 1.090 Time states;

When period of time prescribed or allowed is less than 7 days, intermediate sat, sun and legal holidays shall be excluded in computation. Business days
The RCP's states for MSJ the opposition must be mailed at LEAST 5 days prior to the hearing. Calendar days
Trying to figure out if they are already late and I can win by default.

Default is hard to get unless they are really, I mean really late. At least that's how it is in federal court. I don't know about state.

Also, even if it is oral, you should prepare by writing it. This way you know what you're talking about when you get into court and you can refer to your written document. [I had to tell the judge one day, "Let me get my glasses out of my brief case"]. The judge may even want to look it, if you stumble a little bit. Remember, now, I don't do state court, but I am trying to assist you.

[rubyruby27]

Thanks Roy,

I am going to write down what I plan on saying so I have an idea of how to respond correctly.

Last time I did that the Judge said are you going to read all of that, looks like a lot of papers. I smiled and said yes, sir.

Panick was noticed in his face and he quickly said to the other side did you do this on purpose. Their response No, your Honor, OK, I have to give them the benefit of doubt so I am denying your motion.

This time it won't be so easy to buffalo me.

Can you actually say they are incompetent and they are using the courts to try an intimidate me as a pro se. That their actions up to this point demonstrate contempt and disrespect for the Courts they know as the laws are written at this point the Court has no control on their actions. Since the current laws as such do not allow for monetary sanctions in the form of attorney fee's to pro se, the worst that can happen is they lose this case. Based on thier complaint they know they can't win so they are wasting the Courts time in pursuing this case, simply because they can and the Court's have no power to control their actions or prevent or stop this behavior.

This simple case has wasted my time and the courts time for the past 10 months. The plaintiff calls in at the hearings, they don't respond to the Defendant's motions, they are late in providing information to the Defendant. They don't even know why they are present by telephone for my motion. (they said that at the last hearing). During this entire time they are being paid by their client. While I am not being paid and I an losing work to try and defend an action that should not have been filed, if this alleged account is mine it is outside the SoL which they Plaintiff's are fully aware of from the inception of filing this case. The plaintiffs have my Credit Reports as they pull them every month they know if this alleged account is mine it is outside the SoL yet they proceeded to file this claim, in hopes of receiving a default judgment.

So the Planitiffs can do or not do anything they want and the Courts have no control on their behavior or actions. The reason that monetary sanctions were instituted was to control the behavior and actions of attorney's. When a pro se is involved that control is lost by the courts.

While I have not been able to locate any case law in regards to attorney fee's being awarded to a pro se in Florida, I have found a few cases in other states that have. (case law)

The courts have inherent powers to right a wrong, and the behavior of this plaintiff warrants the courts to use their inherent powers and sanction this firm for thier lack of respect and actions by using their inherent powers to award the Defendant attorney fee's and cost.

To me I am arguing for attorney fee's which is putting the cart before the horse.

Something to this effect is what I want to write but I want it to be eloquent.

[hannah]

Ruby, the judges and the courts must follow the RCP's. They can add to them at a local level but MUST follow that which is allowed by statute which is what the RCP's are. I will look this up if I have a chance but if the RCP's say that you are entitled to discovery without permission of the court, then you are clearly entitled to discovery without the permission of the court and your opponent is blowing smoke.

JDB's are always saying things asked for in discovery are burdensome. Tell them that this whole case has been burdensome for you but you're doing your best to preserve your rights under the law. Go to the law library and do a caselaw search for "budensome discovery", "broad discovery", etc. Every state will have caselaw on discovery as it's one of the most challenged aspects of the pre-trial phase of litigation in all states.

[rubyruby27]

FRCP 7.020 clearly states I am entitled to discovery, the first judge opened the door to the plaintiff and allowed discovery. There is no question that I am allowed discovery by statute.

He denied my first request to compel, and told me to file a court date to be heard on this motion. This is my second request to the courts to compel.

In my last hearing on MIVD this Judge said in the transcript, " I guess maybe to expedite all these matters, if they send you some interrogatories, if you can answer them, you know, get them out. Always keep a copy for yourself".

This remark was directed at the plaintiff.

I don't even care about discovery other than the fact the more they refuse to do discovery the better my chances are of getting sanctions--hopefully attorney fees

Thanks Hannah, am going to the law library tomorrow or Monday.

[rubyruby27]

Ok, I figured this out I think, just took some time not to second quess myself and have tunnel vision.

The RCP's says AT LEAST 5 days before the hearing, that means you don't count the day of court so it must be postmarked by the 13th or they are late. I think.

If it's late I am going for default all they can say is no, if they deny then I go for discovery and a continuance for me to respond to their opposition.

Then I amend my MSJ. I know how to make it more readable and proper now after the fact..

[rubyruby27]

It wasn't in today's mail, so either they are not opposing--any thoughts from anyone on this. Might come on Monday 3-5pm thats when my mail runs. Or they are going to say in Court we thought we were only here for the Motion to Compel.

[hannah]

Originally Posted by rubyruby27

It wasn't in today's mail, so either they are not opposing--any thoughts from anyone on this. Might come on Monday 3-5pm thats when my mail runs. Or they are going to say in Court we thought we were only here for the Motion to Compel.

Check with the court clerk on Monday and ask what motions will be heard at the hearing. Don't volunteer info, just ask. If the clerk says that the opposition will be heard, ask if they have a copy in the file. If so, go get a copy. If the opposition is there it may be a bona fied error that you didn't receive it or it may not...

[rubyruby27]

That is also in my plans, the court docket is online, its not there either, however if they recieved it on Friday it doesn't get posted until Monday. Thanks for the info.

Is there any reason they would object to discovery if they weren't planning on objecting to the MSJ.

[hannah]

Originally Posted by rubyruby27

That is also in my plans, the court docket is online, its not there either, however if they recieved it on Friday it doesn't get posted until Monday. Thanks for the info.

Is there any reason they would object to discovery if they weren't planning on objecting to the MSJ.

It's an automatic response...really it is. Every case I've ever done or helped with objected to some part of the discovery if not all of it. It means more time which means more money and if all they are getting is a percentage of the total amount of the alleged debt, it is not much. Not to mention, they don't have a lot of the answers nor documents usually asked for in discovery for a JDB bought debt so they cannot produce documents and don't know the answers so they object to a lot of it as burdensome. There are several cases in WV where if asked for in discovery and are pertinent to the case, then it's usually ruled not burdensome or too broad. You will need to find caselaw for Florida, however, and I am sure that there is quite a lot of it as there usually is in every state. Use cases most relevent to your case in selecting what to use if there is a lot of it.

Most collection law firms win by default, you know this already...