[JulienPDX]

Hi there, I'm an old customer of Art of credit.com and used the site extensively to fix my credit last summer. Many of the techniques discussed worked wonders.

I had created my own sample combination DV letter/C&D Collection Call Letters and was curious to get some responses to it and maybe ask that it be posted as a sticky.

**************************

Month Date, Year



Scumbag Collections, Inc
1234 Lawbreakers Rd
Anytown, ST 91111
RE: Acct # XXXYYZZ0112

VIA CERTIFIED MAIL; RETURN RECEIPT REQUESTED
(xxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx)

Dear Scumbag Collector

I am in receipt of your letter, dated xx/xx/xxxx, which references an account number XXXXX in the amount of $xxx.xx. This letter serves as my dispute to the validity of the above-referenced debt. I am disputing the debt because (state reason and attach any documents which support the reason for the dispute - i.e. already paid, wrong person, etc.). If this alleged debt has been reported to any consumer reporting agency, you must immediately notify all such consumer reporting agencies of the dispute of this alleged debt.

I will require immediate verification of the allged debt, pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, 15 U.S.C. § 1692g(b). All collection activity on this account should cease until written verification has been provided to me (this includes the continued reporting of this account to any consumer reporting agency.)

Written verification shall include, but is not limited to:

* Copies of any written instruments which evidence that I incurred the debt.
* The original amount of the debt, and an itemization of any interest and fees that are being assessed.
* The date the debt was incurred.
* The name and address of the original creditor.
* A statement that the debt has not been paid.
* A statement that the original creditor provided goods or services in consideration of the debt.


Please cease all contact via telephone with me as of the date of this letter. Any future communications with me, MUST BE in writing, as I do not discuss business over the telephone.

Finally, be advised that your failure to comply with my requests may lead to liability under 15 U.S.C. § 1692k, and I may be entitled to actual damages, court costs, attorney’s fees, and up to $1,000.00 in statutory damages per collection violation.


Sincerely

Your name
YOur address
(NEVER EVER PUT YOUR PHONE NUMBER!!!)

[klinked]

I think it it way too much information. Why tell them what they need?

Certified mail xxxxxxxxxxxx

Dear Scumbag,

I dispute. Please verify this debt. It is inconvenient to call anytime, anywhere.

Regards,

Not Mine


Nice to meet ya, BTW

[JulienPDX]

No offense, but that wasn't the type of response I was looking for and personally, it would seem that a CA wouldnt' respond to something like that.

I have noticed a lot of people on this site and other sites try to play the "dumb consumer" route. I think that is a valid point--but I would go so far as to say that a person should only do that if they have the time to go after CA's in court and win violation cash.

The letter I propose informs a CA that I know my rights and that I have the potential to sue them if they don't follow the rules. I have had much success with this letter; so I respectfully request that it be considered for a sticky since this site doesn't yet seem to have one.

Thanks

[Hedwig]

Actually, klinked is much closer to the truth. When they see you spouting off laws, etc., they think you are using either a credit repair agency or the sample letters found on the internet.

My husband had a charge-off that wasn't his show up on his report. I told him to write a simple letter, but he gave too much information and ended up getting a lot of attention from a JDB who would probably just have gone away. Since he was military, he ended up going to the JAG office (military lawyers). They told him he should have simply said "I do not recognize this debt as mine. I am disputing this debt and ask that you provide proof that the debt is mine and details of how the amount was computed."

End of letter. Of course, we recommend saying that phone contact is inconvenient and to please communicate only in writing.

The next time something showed up (he has a fairly common name and an ex-wife who had opened some accounts in his name) we sent the recommended letter and never heard another word.

Keep it simple, in your own words. Don't give them any information other than that you are disputing.

Also, when you cite laws that early, you may lose the benefit of the "least sophisticated consumer" designation, which is something you don't want to.

[Pale Rider]

Some are in favor of the short version, and there is nothing wrong with that. I always hit them with as many violations as possible right up front. Most never come back for seconds. Now for the letter.

Originally Posted by JulienPDX

Month Date, Year



Scumbag Collections, Inc
1234 Lawbreakers Rd
Anytown, ST 91111
RE: Acct # XXXYYZZ0112

VIA CERTIFIED MAIL; RETURN RECEIPT REQUESTED
(xxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx)

Dear Scumbag Collector

I am in receipt of your letter, dated xx/xx/xxxx, which references an account number XXXXX in the amount of $xxx.xx. This letter serves as my dispute to the validity of the above-referenced debt. I am disputing the debt because (state reason and attach any documents which support the reason for the dispute - i.e. already paid, wrong person, etc.). If this alleged debt has been reported to any consumer reporting agency, you must immediately notify all such consumer reporting agencies of the dispute of this alleged debt.

I will require immediate verification of the allged debt, pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, 15 U.S.C. § 1692g(b). All collection activity on this account should cease until written verification has been provided to me (this includes the continued reporting of this account to any consumer reporting agency.)

There is no time requirement for validation under 809. Some courts have ruled a reasonable time is 90 days, but that is not immediate, and you would have no cause of action if they failed to act that quickly.

Written verification shall include, but is not limited to:

* Copies of any written instruments which evidence that I incurred the debt.
* The original amount of the debt, and an itemization of any interest and fees that are being assessed.
* The date the debt was incurred.
* The name and address of the original creditor.
* A statement that the debt has not been paid.
* A statement that the original creditor provided goods or services in consideration of the debt.

Some of these items are not required to be provided. The courts can determine what must be provided, and it may differ greatly depending on circumstances. The collector should provide validation that is responsive to the dispute.

Please cease all contact via telephone with me as of the date of this letter. Any future communications with me, MUST BE in writing, as I do not discuss business over the telephone.

It would be better to include the word inconvenient here, as that is the only situation that allows for calls to be ceased.

Finally, be advised that your failure to comply with my requests may lead to liability under 15 U.S.C. § 1692k, and I may be entitled to actual damages, court costs, attorney’s fees, and up to $1,000.00 in statutory damages per collection violation.

Most courts say per case. A few have ruled per violation, but this is known by the collectors anyway.


Sincerely

Your name
YOur address
(NEVER EVER PUT YOUR PHONE NUMBER!!!)

I vote no for the sticky until it is rewritten to conform to the statute or court opinions.

[roybean]

There is an example here on the board (although not a sticky), and no we will not make your letter a sticky.

A letter to a CA should be short and to the point.

[JulienPDX]

Okay I must admit that I'm very disappointed with your decision, mr. Moderator. Many people who come to forums complain that they aren't able to come to specialty forums like this and find something like this ..quickly and painfully. I move that forum administrators are perhaps a contributor to the problem--when they dont want to make certain well-sought pieces of information; sticky in forums.

[roybean]

Dispute letters

[JulienPDX]

Month Date, Year



Scumbag Collections, Inc
1234 Lawbreakers Rd
Anytown, ST 91111
RE: Acct # XXXYYZZ0112

VIA CERTIFIED MAIL; RETURN RECEIPT REQUESTED
(xxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx)

Dear Scumbag Collector

I am in receipt of your letter, dated xx/xx/xxxx, which references an account number XXXXX in the amount of $xxx.xx. This letter serves as my dispute to the validity of the above-referenced debt. I am disputing the debt because (state reason and attach any documents which support the reason for the dispute - i.e. already paid, wrong person, etc.). If this alleged debt has been reported to any consumer reporting agency, you must immediately notify all such consumer reporting agencies of the dispute of this alleged debt.

I will require verification of the allged debt, pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, 15 U.S.C. § 1692g(b) as soon as possible. All collection activity on this account should cease until written verification has been provided to me (this includes the continued reporting of this account to any consumer reporting agency.)


Written verification shall include, but is not limited to:

* Copies of any written instruments which evidence that I incurred the debt.
* The original amount of the debt, and an itemization of any interest and fees that are being assessed.
* The date the debt was incurred.
* The name and address of the original creditor.
* A statement that the debt has not been paid.
* A statement that the original creditor provided goods or services in consideration of the debt.

(I did not edit this, because again, why does a court have to DECIDE what is validation; I am specifying the parameters of my own dispute--therefore making it more challenging--I don't see why its a problem to keep this list)

Please cease all contact via telephone with me as of the date of this letter. Any future communications with me, MUST BE in writing, as telephone calls are inconvenient for me.

Finally, be advised that your failure to comply with my requests may lead to liability under 15 U.S.C. § 1692k, and I may be entitled to actual damages, court costs, attorney’s fees.


Sincerely

Your name
YOur address
(NEVER EVER PUT YOUR PHONE NUMBER!!!)

[Pale Rider]

Here is the Towerrat version of how to write a DV.

http://www.infinitecredit.com/forums...0&d=1151861585

[Pale Rider]

A court doesn't have to decide what is validation, but they may need to if you disagree with what the collector sent and a suit is filed by eiither party. The FDCPA does not define validation, and the FTC has refused to put a definition on it, because it can be quite different in each case. You can put whatever you want, but they don't have to provide some of those items, and it does not change what validation may be in your case.

[JulienPDX]

thanks PaleRider, I forgot about good-ol TowerRat, I'd kiss him/her if I could :-)

[JulienPDX]

The other reason I dared define validation/verification is because too often I heard about other people or even somtimes I myself would get just some silly computer printout and couldn't help but have a little fear that simply because the CA had responded, this determined validation.

seems there is always an argument on these sites about validation.

[Qtip]

Originally Posted by JulienPDX

The other reason I dared define validation/verification is because too often I heard about other people or even somtimes I myself would get just some silly computer printout and couldn't help but have a little fear that simply because the CA had responded, this determined validation.

seems there is always an argument on these sites about validation.

Altough I thank you for your post and the effort, I must agree with others here. Validation letters should be short and sweet, no need to give the CA more information than they need. Ultimatelly they are collecting from you, they should know who you are and who they are representing. If they want to spend the 30 days, " from the time I request validation and immediatelly dispute the account with the CRA " asking me the account number, then they need to delete the info on my file. Should they choose to play stupid and send me a letter requesting more info while verifiying my dispute with the CRA as bein correct information; Then they deserve to be sued. More over they should know what constitutes proper validation, why would I want to teach them? Let them hang themselves, least sofisticated consumer prevails.

My 02 canadian cents in the matter

[JulienPDX]

I never said you were wrong, but your "least sophisticated consumer" philosophy rocks for letting them hang themselves but doens't take into account people who may not have the means or the time to sue and just want the reporting to stop.

[Qtip]

Originally Posted by JulienPDX

I never said you were wrong, but your "least sophisticated consumer" philosophy rocks for letting them hang themselves but doens't take into account people who may not have the means or the time to sue and just want the reporting to stop.

Absolutely, you are correct that not everyone is willing to go prose , unfortunatelly your idea of coming informed and strong is not going to deter most CA's. Maybe others can chime in, even after the facts "your rights being stepped all over" You write them a letter with a federal complaint drafted and the sob's will still call your bluff. They do not care about what you think you know, they care about the $$ they can get from you and will play the odds most of the time. Very few CA's are smart enough to know when to back off. You would think a letter telling them of their violations with an attached complaint would get them in gear, unfortunately it does not.

By showing them you know the law, you are removing yourself from the least sophisticated consumer category. Long run, credit repair is not easy and anyone not willing to go the extra mile might as well not begin correcting the inaccuracies. Not triying to put down your aproach. I have personally tried it and have not had much success.

My humble opinion.

[centex]

I believe I would have to go along with the philosophy of letting individual circumstances dictate length. On all of the letters I sent out on the fraud claims, I used a combination DV/ITS that included a settlement amount that I expected from the recipient. It would also go to the underwriter. It ran about two pages, and included a discussion about Chaudhry, but it also got the desired results...sometimes it even produced a check.

However, I would also opine that my letter was not one that should be used by the masses despite its success. As a result, very few iterations of the letter have ever been posted online.

[Hedwig]

But a long, involved letter will not do that. What it will probably get is thrown in the trashcan, necessitating that you do it again or sue them.

As to the type of validation, they can send you the printout anyway and say they validated. If you disagree, you can sue them. Since it's not defined by law, there is no requirement to meet your demands.

[FixinThings]

Making it short and sweet while still including all of the relevant information is appropriate if, i