[farmerracing]

Hello all,
First time poster, long time AOC lurker. Here's the situation. Dentist charges $3,000 for braces, paid $1,500. Patient unhappy with work 1/2 through and stops and goes to another dentist (who again charges full $$$). I tell dentist to adjust bill, and he makes small $300 adjustment, but keeps billing me for $1,200. I tell him via letter of dispute and issues, that just to make this go away I will settle in full for $600. He sends letter back saying he agrees to settle for $600 as long as paid in 30 days.

I send check for $600 45 days later. He cashes check. He then sends account with amount of $1,600 (!) to collection agency which hits my credit report --- I dispute and notify matter is settled in full. Collection agency sends letter saying since I didn't pay in 30 days then the agreement is not valid and it will be on my credit report until the balance is paid in full. I call Dentist office and get the same speech and then letter stating same.

What's my next move? Thanks.

[roybean]

I think they may have you on this because you did everything in writing if I am understanding correctly. Why did you send in 45 instead of the 30 days? Did you contact him prior to sending the money to see if he'd go for it being two weeks late?

[farmerracing]

No I didn't contact him, disconnect was DW sent off the check and didn't realize it was after the date. Yes everything is in writing.

So, another angle. He gets the check which should have been applied to balance, instead puts in collection for even higher amount (ignoring $600 payment). Collection agency sends letter that doesn't have mini miranda...(just a letter). Finally, making the statement "it will stay on your credit until it is paid in full".

No issues?

[Qtip]

Originally Posted by farmerracing

No I didn't contact him, disconnect was DW sent off the check and didn't realize it was after the date. Yes everything is in writing.

So, another angle. He gets the check which should have been applied to balance, instead puts in collection for even higher amount (ignoring $600 payment). Collection agency sends letter that doesn't have mini miranda...(just a letter). Finally, making the statement "it will stay on your credit until it is paid in full".

No issues?

Hi,

First let me say, the dentist is a scumbag "hope his teeth rot" There is allot of info here, please give us more details about the steps.

You state you disputed, did you requet validation from collection agency? Or did you dispute with CRA? Right now if the CA sent you a letter with no mini-miranda they ar already in violation. If it was me, I would send them a validation letter CRRR. Generic, not leading that you know your rights, then immediatelly after receiving the green card I would dispute the debt with the CRA's for dispute simply use "account disputed" If they fail to mark the account as disputed then you are racking up more violations.

Once I have what I feel are enough violations, I sent a ITS with a Drafted federal complaint and give them 15 days to remove the crap from my report and request some cash for the violations "1000.00" If they fail to do that afther the 15th day I tell them that the complaint could be filed in court without further notice to them.

[farmerracing]

1. I send letter to dentist offering settlement
2. Dentist sends a letter back accepting as long as paid within 30 days.
3. DW sends check out to Dentist 45 days later.
4. Dentist sends account to collection agency
5. No letter from CA, notice on CR 50 days later.
6. I send letter to CA outlining settled in full and also disputed.
7. I call Dentist and tell him to recall the collections, he confirmed he recieved the check.
8. I get letter back (with no "from a debt collector") from CA saying they talked with Dentist and I paid too late so will stay in my credit report until I pay. (isn't this a false statement?)
9. I get letter from Dentist saying I paid too late, too bad.

[centex]

There might be some out of the box remedies, but first it is necessary to know what the problem was that led to you wanting to breach the contract (orthodontic work is often a written contract).

Additionally, did that contract contain provisions in the event that either party breached?

Are there issues that lend themselves to the filing of a complaint with the appropriate state regulatory entity? Orthodontists are probably covered under the dental regulatory people.

[Qtip]

Originally Posted by farmerracing

1. I send letter to dentist offering settlement
2. Dentist sends a letter back accepting as long as paid within 30 days.
3. DW sends check out to Dentist 45 days later.
4. Dentist sends account to collection agency
5. No letter from CA, notice on CR 50 days later.
6. I send letter to CA outlining settled in full and also disputed.
7. I call Dentist and tell him to recall the collections, he confirmed he recieved the check.
8. I get letter back (with no "from a debt collector") from CA saying they talked with Dentist and I paid too late so will stay in my credit report until I pay. (isn't this a false statement?)
9. I get letter from Dentist saying I paid too late, too bad.

Thanks for the summarry of events, Centex is goot thinking out the box; give her an opportunity to help.

If it was me, altought there are crearlly some vioaltions from the CA. I would request validation, you stated you disputed debt. If so then disputed the collection with the CRA's and if they come back verrified and CA fails to mark the account as disputed then you have more violations "continued collection activity". I personally like to have at least three violations prior to taking legal action. Not a rule as I been known to take legal action with just one violation.

[Pale Rider]

Possible violations so far:

FDCPA

809 (b) Continued collection activity

809 (b) failure to provide validation

807 (2) The false representation of -- (A) the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or - Did not report payment

807 (8) Communicating false credit information - $1600, where did extra amount come from

807 (8) failure to mark account as in dispute

807 (10) Deceptive means to collect a debt - statement that it would stay on report until paid

Check state laws for licensing/bonding of collector, etc.

Wondering if this type of service would fall under FCBA???

[Pale Rider]

Forget the FCBA - it is not open end credit, and quality of service does not fall under FCBA. I think you do have some violations to work with, and possibly more under state laws.

[Qtip]

Originally Posted by Pale Rider

Possible violations so far:

FDCPA

809 (b) Continued collection activity

809 (b) failure to provide validation

807 (2) The false representation of -- (A) the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or - Did not report payment

807 (8) Communicating false credit information - $1600, where did extra amount come from

807 (8) failure to mark account as in dispute

807 (10) Deceptive means to collect a debt - statement that it would stay on report until paid

Check state laws for licensing/bonding of collector, etc.

Wondering if this type of service would fall under FCBA???

Holly crap, thank you for breaking it down!!!! That is certainlly mor than the three violations it takes me to file lol

[roybean]

Originally Posted by farmerracing

No I didn't contact him, disconnect was DW sent off the check and didn't realize it was after the date. Yes everything is in writing.

So, another angle. He gets the check which should have been applied to balance, instead puts in collection for even higher amount (ignoring $600 payment). Collection agency sends letter that doesn't have mini miranda...(just a letter). Finally, making the statement "it will stay on your credit until it is paid in full".

No issues?

Yes, you have issues and what Centex and PR said too. This may take a little work, and like Centex said, 'thinking out of the box', but I think you may be able to work with this Dentist on his level (underhanded). Hey you gotta do whatcha gotta do.
As to your question, "What's your next move?" I know you said it was on your credit report, but has the new amount surfaced on the reports yet? If so, let's add some FCRA violations. What do you want to do? Do you just want it off your report and settle with the dentist or do you want to do battle?

[farmerracing]

Originally Posted by centex

There might be some out of the box remedies, but first it is necessary to know what the problem was that led to you wanting to breach the contract (orthodontic work is often a written contract).

Additionally, did that contract contain provisions in the event that either party breached?

Are there issues that lend themselves to the filing of a complaint with the appropriate state regulatory entity? Orthodontists are probably covered under the dental regulatory people.

Humm. I will have to look into this. DW is the one who signed everything, I just was listed as the "responsible" party. Never seen a contract, braces were for child.

[Pale Rider]

Did you send a letter with the $600 check detailing your dispute and what the payment was for, or that it was payment in full?

Did you write anything on the check such as "payment in full"?

[farmerracing]

Yes, with the check was the settlement letter (which said in full). On the check said "payment in full".

[farmerracing]

I meant a (copy) of the settlement letter...was sent with the check.

[hannah]

Are you and wife divorced with her having custody?

[Pale Rider]

Originally Posted by farmerracing

Yes, with the check was the settlement letter (which said in full). On the check said "payment in full".

In some states that would be considered a restrictive endorsement, or accord and satsifaction. Usually there has to be a dispute about the amount (which there was), a new agreement or settlement (accord), and a payment for the agreed amount (satifaction). You may be able to get past the 30 days, by claiming they accepted the offer with the restriction and cashed the check.

Did the settlement letter have the 30 day provision?

What state are you in?

[Qtip]

farmerracing,

Please do not be intimidated by the amount of questions. It helps everyone when they understand the situation completelly. That way you will get the most accurate information.

[farmerracing]

Originally Posted by hannah

Are you and wife divorced with her having custody?

No we aren't divorced.